Mahara Wayman [00:00:05]:
Welcome to the art of badassery where I explore what it takes to live life on your own terms. Break free from the status quo and unleash your inner badass. Whether you're a rebel at heart or simply seeking inspiration to step outside your comfort zone, this podcast is for you. I'm your host, Mahara Wayman and each week I dive into the stories, insights and strategies of those who have mastered the art of badassery and are living life to the fullest. They smile when no one is looking. Welcome to the Art of Badassery podcast. My name is Mahara, and I'm so excited to have my good friend, Jody Graham, join us for her second visit on the show. Jody brings an impressive mix of expertise as a chartered professional accountant, university trained coach, registered collaborative professional, and mediator.
Mahara Wayman [00:01:01]:
She combines financial know how with compassionate coaching to help people navigate the challenges of divorce. Having personally experienced divorce, Jody understands the emotional journey that her clients face. Her unique approach blends empathy with practical strategies, ensuring her clients receive holistic support during the tough times. We are going to dive into her work with the bank Code Personality Science System and explore how mastering communication skills can transform both personal and professional relationships. But, of course, we wanna know about her badassery. So let's start there. Jody, first of all, welcome back to the show. How you been?
Jodi Graham [00:01:42]:
Oh, great. Thank you for having me back a second time. I think I'm your first person that gets to do it twice.
Mahara Wayman [00:01:48]:
So, so exciting. Alright. So love that who you're working with today and what it is that you bring to that experience. And we are gonna get to that, but can you take us back to what it was you felt that you learned about yourself when you were going through divorce?
Jodi Graham [00:02:05]:
So I went through divorce back in 2013. My ex husband, when I went through the collaborative process, which, you know, nobody should ever go through the court process. It's a horrible process, but we chose we started out going through the mediation process and ultimately ended up going through the collaborative process. And the one thing that I learned through that and I didn't have the language for it back then, but really what that process looks through and looks through is the interest based negotiation and really really looking at what's within the best interest of the family unit. What's within the best interest of our kids? What was in the best interest for me, what was within the best interest for him. And like I said, I I didn't have the language back then, but it was just such an empowering process. I felt like I had a say in what the outcome of it would be. Go through the legal process, if you're going through the courts, you have a judge that doesn't know anything about you making your decisions for your future.
Jodi Graham [00:03:07]:
And I just found it to be such an empowering process where I felt like I could say yes and no to certain things. There were other parts of it that were were were hard because there were things that I I wanted to go a certain way and they didn't, But I I grew during that time. And what got me into divorce coaching in the first place is after all was said and done, at one point, my ex husband said something about, you know, this this divorce, it's your fault. It was me that chose to leave the marriage. And he said, this is your fault that all of this cost me $12,000. And I just about fell off my chair because it only cost me 4.
Mahara Wayman [00:03:50]:
Hey. Why the discrepancy? So
Jodi Graham [00:03:53]:
here's what I figured out in having some conversation is because I am a charter professional accountant, spreadsheets don't scare me. And so I would meet with my lawyer, talk a little bit about kind of how we might handle some things. I would go and then do my own number crunching, build my own spreadsheets, look at the scenarios. What does this mean for my future? What does that mean for my future? And then we would meet for what they call a four way meeting. So him and I and then our and our two lawyers, we would spend the afternoon hashing things out. I would have a 10 minute debrief with my lawyer after. I would go away, and I again, I would work through my scenarios, what what's this all gonna mean. My husband was doing the same, only he was doing it with his lawyer because he is not computer savvy.
Jodi Graham [00:04:43]:
So working through a spreadsheet is just something he wasn't gonna do. And so he was struggling to understand some of it. He was in in absolute overwhelm. Like, he's not a stupid man, but he just he was in absolute overwhelm and was having a hard time figuring out, okay, what does this mean for me in the future? And so he was spending an awful lot of time with his lawyer working through all of that stuff that I was doing on my own. He was paying his lawyer $450 an hour working through all of that. And so that's why it cost him so much more because I was literally spending maybe an extra half hour with my lawyer outside of our our four way meetings. Whereas he was spending hours with him because he just was feeling extremely overwhelmed. And then so that was in 2013.
Jodi Graham [00:05:30]:
I got my coaching certification in 2016, and I started getting friends and family saying, hey. Like, I'm going through this. I'm feeling overwhelmed. They're they were in the situation he was in. I'm feeling overwhelmed. I don't understand my numbers. I don't know what I'm going to be able to afford. Am I going to be able to afford to buy out the house? Should I buy out the house? Should I just walk away? Like, I don't know what to do.
Jodi Graham [00:05:52]:
And so I started helping them and started building a repertoire of spreadsheets that I could use to help explain where they were at. And it just kind of started to snowball a little bit. And then in 2022, I think it was, a gal that I've known since I was, gosh, 4 years old. She's a family lawyer. I was chatting with her a little bit, and she's like, why don't you become a registered collaborative professional and be a neutral for us in the collaborative process? And so I didn't even know that was a thing because we didn't use them as part of our process, but I started taking the courses that were required. The first course was interest based negotiation, and that's when I learned what it meant. Like because I didn't have the language then, but what they took us through in 2013 was really interest based negotiation. And I've I've just really, really to me, it's such an empowering process.
Jodi Graham [00:06:44]:
And if people would just park the egos a little bit and recognize that you don't have to have your day in court, You can get through divorce with some compassion and some empowerment, and you're gonna come a way better ahead of it.
Mahara Wayman [00:07:01]:
Well, it sure sounds like it. But I wanna go back a little bit further. When did you, Jody, let the ego go in your divorce process, or did you?
Jodi Graham [00:07:12]:
Oh, I didn't. I didn't. I actually ended up having a nervous breakdown during our divorce, honestly. Yeah. Because I was trying so hard to maintain control of everything and to to be the badass in all of it and stand my ground. I I was gaslit a lot during my marriage, and I was bound and determined I was not gonna let that happen through the divorce. So I I kept my guard up a lot. And what happened is is that I was not showing up as my best self at work because and my my counselor explained it to me later, is I was trying so hard to keep that facade up that probably subconsciously certainly, it wasn't consciously because I would never treat people this way consciously.
Jodi Graham [00:07:57]:
But going to work, like, I was being bitchy to everybody. I was being I wasn't I wasn't hearing people out. I was cutting them off. I was and I've I've since learned after when I went through harassment in the workplace, I showed up the same way. Again, I was subconsciously trying to maintain that control and that ego was there, and my best self was not showing up. And so it wasn't until I had a boss that I had known for many many years, him and I had worked together in various times throughout my career, walked into my office and basically called me out and told me how much of a bitch I was being. And I fell apart. I ended up having to reach out to a friend or a colleague that I had and said I need your help.
Jodi Graham [00:08:44]:
And I was literally in my office in the fetal position on the floor sobbing. Because I was ashamed. I was overwhelmed. I was I was broken.
Mahara Wayman [00:09:00]:
Thank you for for sure to give us that backstory. Would you say then that part of being a badass for you was letting go of that tight control that you felt you needed?
Jodi Graham [00:09:10]:
Mhmm. Oh, absolutely. And it wasn't until the divorce was over that I was able to finally let go of all of that. And it took a lot of therapy and a lot of personal growth and development. I went on a spiritual journey. Yeah. It was it was it was hard to let go of that ego, and it was hard to let go of that feeling of needing to be right. But, you know, when all was said and done, I walked away from a 21 year relationship.
Jodi Graham [00:09:40]:
We were together for 21 years, married for 19. And I walked away with a few pieces of furniture and some household kitchen items. And I just I walked away. And people people will often say, like, well, like, how is that within the best interest of the family? And I'm like, well, what he was looking for was I was the major breadwinner in the family, and he was looking for fairly substantial financial support where I don't think I don't know what I would have been able to afford. I remember I was running my own numbers. I knew that if I had to give him the kind of money that he was looking for, I would have had a hard time paying rent, and I probably would have had to have a small apartment with 3 kids. And so I knew that by walking away from the like, my share of the equity in our matrimonial home was a far better financial deal for me than paying that spousal support. I I paid child support, and I never begrudged him the child support.
Jodi Graham [00:10:38]:
It was a bitter pill to swallow because it was a substantial amount for well, one of my kids was already 18, so it was for the other 2. But it was it was a substantial amount. And I knew that if I had to pay the extra spousal support, I don't know how I would have lived. And so it was within my best interest to just say, fine. Take it all. It's all yours. I gave him a little bit of my pension. He kept his pension, but I walked away.
Jodi Graham [00:11:06]:
And I am more financially stable now than I ever was when we were married. I have more money in my savings. I've bounced back. I've I've taken control. I'm remarried now. I'm happily remarried. But it wasn't it was probably about 6 months or so after the divorce when I was in my own home. I was no longer walking on eggshells that I started to find who I was, and I was able to let the ego go.
Mahara Wayman [00:11:34]:
So talk to thank you for that as well. Talk to us a bit about this idea of finding out who you are because you and I have worked together. We've run a retreat together. It's like that coaches recognize, you know, get to know yourself better, be authentic. And then it's actually the base of being badass is being finding yourself. But what the hell does that look like? I mean, seriously, there are people listening going, oh my god. These girls are woo woo. But Yeah.
Mahara Wayman [00:12:00]:
Yeah. Let's have an honest conversation about what that actually means and what it meant to you in that moment.
Jodi Graham [00:12:07]:
What it meant to me so I I've always been fiercely independent, much to my parents dismay, and I felt like I lost that. Like, I I didn't ever wanna make decisions because I was always trying to keep the peace. So I often let myself be ruled or governed or whatever by what my ex husband wanted to do. And so I felt like I lost kind of who I was. I didn't feel like I had a say. I didn't feel like I had a voice in our marriage for 20 years. And so for me, it was really about understanding and
Mahara Wayman [00:12:45]:
kind
Jodi Graham [00:12:45]:
of learning again what I enjoy doing. What were my hobbies? What was what was most important to me? Just feeling comfortable in my own skin again. I didn't really recognize until after I was out that I had I just felt a lot of shame with my body. We had really lost contact into like, we didn't have good intimacy in the latter part of our marriage. And not not for his lack of trying, I just had completely lost interest. And so I had to rediscover who I was as a woman, wanting and having sexual needs and desires again because I just felt so turned off by it in my marriage because I was struggling with mental health issues. Like, I had depression, I had anxiety, and I really just had to get my mental health in check. So for me, finding who I was was about accepting and being okay with saying, I am depressed.
Jodi Graham [00:13:49]:
I have anxiety. I and it doesn't define me. It doesn't come down to my worth. I'm still worthy and I'm somebody who's worthy that is depressed. I am worthy and I have anxiety. I am worthy, and I'm battling some weight issues that I had at the moment. And I had to really find my self worth, and it really took a lot of inner reflection. I had to do some inner child work.
Jodi Graham [00:14:19]:
I had to quiet the inner monkey that was the the inner asshole, as I like to refer to him, is, you know, you're not enough. You never have been enough. This is your fault that everything fell apart. And I do take some responsibility. Like, I don't ever wanna paint the picture that everything in our marriage was my ex husband's fault. There were things that I know I could have done differently, but I had to face that. I had to learn and understand and accept that, you know, there are things that I could have done differently in that marriage, but it's not all on me either. And so it really was and self forgiveness was a big part of it.
Jodi Graham [00:14:59]:
Like, the guilt that I had after walking away. I I got myself into financial trouble after I walked away because the guilt was so high that it was like, well, I don't want my kids to want for anything. I bought them each a TV for their room. I bought them all new fancy bedding for their bedrooms. I walked away and left all the stuff at home. So or the matrimonial home. So I bought them all new bedroom suites, and I had to buy I just went on a spending spree because I didn't want them to ever think, well, we used to have that, now we don't. And I got myself into financial trouble where I like I literally went to the bank and I had to beg them.
Jodi Graham [00:15:39]:
Because they consolidated all my debt at the onset of my divorce. And then 2 years later, I was back again saying I need to consolidate debt and they're like, you are a high risk woman. No. We're not gonna give it to you. And I was absolutely panicked because I could not get ahead. My credit cards were maxed out. I like, I was just in debt. And so I begged them to give me another chance.
Jodi Graham [00:16:05]:
They gave me another consolidation loan. I lowered my right leg credit on my credit cards. I looked just at everything possible. And within about 3 years after that, I was debt free with the exception of my mortgage. Because I just had to get focused and get real because I I just lost control.
Mahara Wayman [00:16:23]:
Okay. I I wanna jump in here. So many so many great things that you that you've shared with us, and I'm sure our listeners can really appreciate a lot of them and and maybe relate to them. One of the things that really stuck out for me though was this idea that while we can want to feel badass, there are sneaky little components of that we often still tell ourselves. And those stories can result in debilitating feelings like guilt. So let's go back and talk a little bit more about these narratives that you had in your head of I'm not good and I need to use money, you know, whatever the stories were. What were some of the biggest ones in that time? Whether you call it inner asshole or or limiting belief or storytelling, doesn't matter. Share with us what some of the biggest ones were.
Jodi Graham [00:17:17]:
The the biggest one is just that I'm not enough. I am not enough of a mom for my kids. I am not enough of an employee where I'm at. It's like I'm I felt like I was a fraud. And I felt like at some point the gig was gonna be up and everybody was gonna discover that I wasn't as strong as I was professing to be. Like I said, I've been a consummate independent, like, no one was ever gonna tell me what to do. I've been so fiercely independent my entire life. And walking away from that marriage, I I had a fear that I was gonna be discovered as being somebody who wasn't as strong as I've always professed to be.
Jodi Graham [00:18:02]:
And I always was just kind of waiting for that next shoe to drop. And it was it was so hard to realize and recognize that you know what? You are strong. Like, it it it just took a lot of self reflection, a lot of journaling, a lot of journaling. And man, my my last dog I have new puppies now, but my last dog that I just had to put down back in April. Man, if he could have talked, it would not have been a good scene because when my kids were with their dad and it was just me and the dog, I poured my heart out to him and just I was journaling and I would be talking out loud while I was journaling and it just really took me finding that level of self love and and it's really hard to explain how you do that.
Mahara Wayman [00:18:47]:
Yeah. And
Jodi Graham [00:18:48]:
as coaches, we try and we do everything we can, but it really there's kind of that moment where you realize and recognize, you know what? You don't get to where you are if you're not strong. And you have to I just finished reading the book the gap and the gain and and they put it beautifully where if you really want to see where you've come, like where you're at and what you've accomplished, you have to measure backwards. You have to measure backwards. So when I think of where I am or where I was say 5 years post divorce, and I measure backwards, I was falling apart. I was in the fetal position on my office floor. 5 years later, I was now debt free, because I had got my shit together. And I started to recognize how strong I was, and I put in a plan and started watching my money and started making better choices, that was the growth. And is there any one moment? No.
Jodi Graham [00:19:46]:
It was a series of small choices along the way. Small recognitions and and recognizing, you know what? You don't get to that point if you're not strong and you're not a badass.
Mahara Wayman [00:19:58]:
Such a good call out recognizing the strength of that we have within ourselves regardless of what choices we've made. When you think of your clients today, Jodi, with the work that you do, would you say that financial freedom or financial guilt plays a big part in in what your clients are navigating post divorce or during divorce?
Jodi Graham [00:20:21]:
You know, that is the root of pretty much everything that I'm talking to them. It's always a fear of money in some way. And it's it'll come back as well. I need to keep the house. I need to keep the matrimonial home. And and my job is like, well, why? Why do you need to keep it? Well, but this is where my kids were born. This is the what my kids understand. And it's like, k.
Jodi Graham [00:20:45]:
But your kids are gonna be happy wherever you are. They're just 4 walls. But part of my work that I do with them is okay. So what does it mean for you to keep that matrimonial home? What does it do to you financially? And so much of the anxiety is around what am I gonna be able to afford? What am I not gonna be able to afford? Am I gonna be able to get child support? Am I gonna be able to get spousal support? Most of my clients are are women because my ideal client are ones that are feeling overwhelmed with the process. They're feeling overwhelmed with their numbers. They just they don't know what they mean. They don't know what that means for them going into the future. And so I'm really helping them to build financial literacy.
Jodi Graham [00:21:33]:
And so many of them are just they're feeling paralyzed because they just don't know that they're going to be okay. And I I I've had conversations with and I'm not going to get into the whole relationship thing, but there's one person that that really just kind of dismissed me when I I said, you know, I was going leaving my husband and gonna get divorced and just kind of left me hanging. And I I did say to them later, I'm like, you know what? It really hurt that you just kind of said I don't know what to say and hung up. And I'm like, all I needed to hear was I'm gonna you're gonna be okay. And they're like, but I didn't know if you were gonna be okay or not and so I didn't feel like it was appropriate to say. And I'm like, really? I'm like, everybody's gonna be okay. Everybody coming out of divorce is going to be okay. It's what does okay mean to you? How do you define okay? How do you yeah.
Jodi Graham [00:22:27]:
Like, it's it really comes down to the what you're telling yourself. Right? You can sit in the pity party, and I tell every single one of my clients, there is life after divorce if you choose to live it.
Mahara Wayman [00:22:41]:
K. So part of being a badass is making choices for yourself and recognizing that Absolutely. You've been making choices all along. Up until now, you may realize that those choices actually don't work for you. And, you know, I have this conversation fairly regularly with my clients when I'm coaching them is you have agency in your life. Look at all of the choices you've made. Yes. Some of them may not have turned out the way you wanted.
Mahara Wayman [00:23:03]:
You may feel some guilt or remorse or disappointment, but that's you still have agency. You still have choice. Alright. So let's take it let's bring it forward a little bit. I can't help my eyes keep going to the bank code in your behind you. What the hell is that?
Jodi Graham [00:23:19]:
So bank code is a personality science. It was designed by a gal by the name of Sherry Tree down in the US. And where it started so she works in the or she worked in the financial planning insurance industry. And she got really tired of hearing that in order to get a yes, you have to get more no's. And she thought this is just stupid. So she thought, you know what? What triggers people to say yes and what triggers people to say no to financial decisions? So there's all kinds of different personality science out there. There's like DISC and SDI and Myers Briggs and all kinds of different ones. This one was really rooted in why people make decisions to make or to buy something.
Jodi Graham [00:24:05]:
So financial decisions. So it's rooted in buying behavior. And so she developed what is called B. A. N. C. N. C.
Jodi Graham [00:24:13]:
Is an acronym that stands for blueprint, action, nurture, knowledge. K? So each one of the 4 personalities will make a decision for different reasons when they're making a financial decision or when they're or even in relationships. So let's kind of walk through quickly. We got blueprints, very structured, Credentials mean a lot to them. They love process. Timeliness is so important to them. Like, you don't ever wanna be late with showing up with the blueprint. Action individuals, they really love freedom.
Jodi Graham [00:24:50]:
They're more of the risk takers. Blueprints, not risk takers at all. Actions, they're willing to take a risk. They're just looking for the opportunity and they want things to happen faster. Nurturers, just like it sounds, they're grounded in relationship. Their community is very important to them. Ethical behavior is really important to them. And then you have your knowledge, which are their research.
Jodi Graham [00:25:15]:
They're a little bit more tech. They like big picture thinking. And so when you look at it I've been I've been doing leadership coaching for years. I've really like, the divorce coaching stuff, etcetera, kind of morphed over time and I realized, hey. This is this is actually where my passion is. And so I used to use personality science with leaders all the time. It's only been recently that I'm like, you know, it actually plays really well when you're talking about negotiating through a divorce because it's based on making financial decisions and that's what you're doing through a divorce. Divorce is it's a business transaction.
Jodi Graham [00:25:51]:
And that's the thing. People need to learn to park their emotions at the door when they walk into those four way meetings because divorce is a business
Mahara Wayman [00:26:00]:
deal. Ding ding ding ding ding ding. I've never heard anybody say that before. So how easy is it for you was it for you at the time to separate the
Jodi Graham [00:26:13]:
2? Absolutely not. Okay. That's just That's what I'm bringing to the table now. Right? Like, I'm trying to help my clients recognize that when you walk into that door, you need to approach this like a business. The other prob I guess issue that people have is they treat their lawyers like a therapist, or they treat their lawyers like their coach. And they're telling their people, Irel or their lawyers, irrelevant information. It doesn't matter that he talked down to you. It doesn't matter that he that you felt belittled or gaslit or, you know, other than making sure that the lawyers know how to keep that behavior in check during the negotiations.
Jodi Graham [00:26:55]:
But that doesn't change the the financial component of getting getting this divorce settled and settling out property and getting to an agreement.
Mahara Wayman [00:27:04]:
So I just wanna call out what a big that must have been for you. Even just hearing you talk about it now. No. We're saying that I was thinking, jeez, can you imagine Bill Gates in the negotiation? He's like, well, you made me feel like shit.
Jodi Graham [00:27:19]:
Yeah. Right? It doesn't that's not how it works. But it's you know, you have to acknowledge how they're feeling. But the why I say to come to me as a coach, in addition to your lawyer, is you can have those conversations with me. I meet you where you are. I'm a I'm a trained coach and I'm a financial professional. I can help you understand your numbers. I can help you gain some confidence in moving forward.
Jodi Graham [00:27:44]:
I can help you get so that you can advocate for yourself in that negotiation, but I can also help you feel a little bit better about the emotional side of things and and recognizing the fears that you have around you know what? My kids have never spent a night away from me, and I don't wanna share them 5050. Okay. I hear you. Let's talk that out. And so I can meet you in that regard too. I'm also not a mental health professional. And I will say to somebody, you know what that what you're talking about here, you need a therapist to help you with that. I can't help you there.
Jodi Graham [00:28:16]:
You gotta deal with the traumas that you've been dealing with. Like if you've got trauma coming out of your marriage or you have childhood trauma that you have to process in order to help you move through that, I I will stay in my swim lane. But if you're just wanting help trying to get your emotions in check so that you can walk into that room and treat it like the business deal that it actually is. And so that's really where bank can come into play because I get my clients to crack their code. I know what their codes are. Like, I am an NBKA, so I'm a nurture blueprint knowledge action. So my first two codes, I'm all about the relationships. I'm all about community, but I'm also very process driven.
Jodi Graham [00:28:59]:
I want to make sure and so, you know, as a lawyer, when they're negotiating with with their clients, knowing if somebody could know my bank code because knowledge, which is my 3rd code, that's your stress code. And so with a knowledge person and their stress code, you'll often see them go inward, they get quiet, because they're processing, and they're trying to figure every possible outcome before they speak. And so and they want to hold they want to go home and research it before they agree to anything. If if my lawyer had seen me go inside and saw me go quiet, it could be, k. You know what? Now is the time for a time out. Take me out of the room and say, hey. What's happening? K. Let's this is what the process is gonna look like for the rest of the day.
Jodi Graham [00:29:45]:
Remember, a blueprint knowledge blueprint. They wanna know what the process is gonna be. Walk me through. Okay? This is what the process is gonna be for the rest of the day. Remember, this is for your kids. You are working to try and figure out the best solution for your kids. They're grounding me back in relationship. They're gonna bring me back to the place because I should not be making decisions from my stress code.
Mahara Wayman [00:30:09]:
Wow. Okay. So let me just get be very clear here. You bring to your clients into the process this personality understanding. Mhmm. How's how's that been received? What do people
Jodi Graham [00:30:23]:
You know, a lot of them, they don't they don't necessarily know. I I get them to crack their code, but I don't sit and like, I'm not gonna spend their money explaining all of it to them. I use it to help me better communicate with them. And I'm working right now trying to bring it to the legal community into the collaborative process so that the lawyers will start bringing it in. And so they don't necessarily I wouldn't say they receive or not receive because it just really focuses my communication with them. Like, right, I don't sit there and and, you know, give them a whole debrief on what it means. I just say in order for help me in order for me to help you, I would like you to take this quick 92nd assessment. It's just so that it helps me figure out how to communicate with you better.
Jodi Graham [00:31:09]:
Beautiful. And they're most of them right? Yeah. Okay. Whatever. So it would be.
Mahara Wayman [00:31:13]:
Thank you for clarifying. I really appreciate that. Yeah. Okay. So this is how long have you been knee deep in this component of your coaching business?
Jodi Graham [00:31:24]:
You know, this one's still fairly recent. I, gosh. I got trained in this in 2020. Used it as part of more the leadership side of things. It's probably been in the last 6 to 8 months that I've really started really digging into it and using it, and I've developed an 8 week program that I wanna bring to the lawyer the legal community. I did have to get approvals through bank to make sure that I wasn't breaking any of their training rules and stuff like that, and I've got that approval now. And so, you know, in September, I'm looking to launch my very first official coaching cohort where I'm trying to bring in legal professionals. Basically, anybody that touches a collaborative process.
Jodi Graham [00:32:09]:
So it could be lawyers, financial professionals, mortgage brokers, anybody to say if you're part of that collaborative process. Because that way, everybody interacting with those clients are going to be speaking in the same language. Right? It's kind of like if you're trying to communicate in French to somebody that doesn't speak French. Right? They're not going to completely understand even if they have cursory level. So you think there's 4 different codes. If you're only speaking to them in your code and they're different, you only have about a quarter of a chance of actually speaking to them in their code. And when you think that there are 24 different
Mahara Wayman [00:32:50]:
combinations of those 4 codes, you have about a 4% chance of speaking to them in their exact code. And so it's just super powerful. So correct me if I'm wrong. What I'm hearing is you've actually got 2 ideal clients. You've got the people that are going through the divorce Yeah. But the people that are supporting them in their divorce. Yeah. Yeah.
Mahara Wayman [00:33:14]:
So totally badass people is to have multiple ideal clients because you can actually spread your business and be have more of a 3 60 business.
Jodi Graham [00:33:24]:
Just as Well, and I look so I've couple years ago, I was doing leadership coaching and divorce coaching more on the side, and it has slowly shifted over. And so now my focus is all things divorce. So I do divorce coaching. I work with the lawyers and legal professional, and I do mediation with, folks that are going through divorce to help them try and keep their costs and stuff down. So but I don't do leadership coaching at all. Well, I I have 2 coaching clients that are just kind of residual from my days of doing leadership coaching that they just continue to work with me. But I my whole focus is making the divorce process better. So I wanna when I do mediation, my goal is to to do it and approach it with empathy, bringing together all the financial piece that I have, using bank to make sure that I'm speaking to them in their language, and they're feeling seen, heard, and understood throughout the whole process.
Jodi Graham [00:34:18]:
I document everything and then hand them over to the lawyers to say, okay. Wrap this up. Working with the lawyers to help them understand how can you communicate better because you can get if you talk to them in a way that resonates with them, which is what bank will teach you to do, you're gonna get them to yes faster. And for some, they're like, well, yeah. But, you know, you can might look at it and think, yeah. But, you know, because they always hear lawyers are money hungry. Right? They're they wanna drag this out. No, they don't.
Jodi Graham [00:34:47]:
They don't wanna drag it out. They wanna get you to a yes faster because there's there's a lineup of clients for them. Sadly, the divorce industry is not dying. And so there's there's always more work to go around. And so they want you to get to resolution as quickly as you can because they don't wanna see you direct this out. And so this is where bank can really help them to do that.
Mahara Wayman [00:35:10]:
So what's the biggest thing, bad ass thing that you've learned about yourself in this process? Because what I'm hearing is, another side note to being bad ass, is it's okay to pivot your business when needed.
Jodi Graham [00:35:20]:
Mhmm. Get a pivot
Mahara Wayman [00:35:21]:
in your life when needed. So what have you learned about yourself in this pivot, Jody?
Jodi Graham [00:35:25]:
That I am just super passionate about people finding resolution in a way where everybody's feels seen, heard, and understood. Like, I, as a coach, that was the very first thing I think that I remember them telling me when I went to Royal Roads to to get my coaching certification is the coaching industry is as big as it is because people at the top, going through divorce, whatever it is, they just want to be seen, heard, and understood. That's what got me into divorce coaching. And to me, bank takes it to the next level. And I am just passionate about helping people learn how to make sure that their clients feel seen, heard, and understood throughout the whole process. I just feel it's so important.
Mahara Wayman [00:36:14]:
It is important, and I just wanna thank you for the work that you do. I know how important it is. We are friends. We're both coaches, and all anybody ever wants is to be seen and heard and understood. Right? They may not feel like they need to be understood, but to be seen and heard is definitely top of the list. When it comes to what you can how you can support potential clients, do you have anything available for potential clients to sort of get them thinking about what they need to do or what they can do as they contemplate divorce?
Jodi Graham [00:36:48]:
So I do have on my website, I have a divorce guide that you can just you can download or purchase. It's a small amount. Just to kind of help you get everything organized. It goes through it talks a little bit about, what you need to gather for your financials. It takes into consideration what you need to think about if you're dealing with kids and co parenting. It's just kind of a beginner how to guide. I do offer a free 1 hour consult to just reach out, talk to me, help me or help you to understand how I can help and support you through the process. I would say that before you even contact a lawyer, contact me and let me help you get everything as far along as possible before you start engaging with the lawyers.
Jodi Graham [00:37:37]:
Because the more prepared you are upfront when you walk in the door to have that conversation with your lawyer, you can significantly reduce your costs. If you can walk in with a pre completed package of all of your financial disclosure, all of your financial information, and you've gotten some of your emotions in check so that you are treating this divorce like a business deal. And I work with one side or I work with both sides. Some of my clients have come to me, have not engaged with a lawyer yet, and I have literally walked through even if I'm not doing a formal mediation, I wouldn't I would call it almost like mediation light. I'm literally just helping them document everything. Document all your financials. Document what do you what do you agree on and what are you disagreeing on? And I'll do up a document that you can take to your lawyer and say, you know what? Out of everything, we agree on 80%. We don't really agree on this 20%.
Jodi Graham [00:38:33]:
And that's where your lawyers can kick in and help you to negotiate that last 20%. It will significantly help you reduce your costs with your lawyers.
Mahara Wayman [00:38:43]:
That, of course, is totally badass. Jody, thank you so much for sharing your wisdom with us today. And really, there's there's so much that you've shared that I know that our audience will appreciate. What are a couple of tips that you'd like to leave with us on how to experience badassery in in everyday life?
Jodi Graham [00:39:08]:
Be true to you. Be authentic in what and how you want out of life. Like, don't be go through life kind of unapologetically. Like, that and I don't mean that, like, be rude and don't be, you know but live your life on your terms and don't apologize for being badass and who you are. Like, you should never have to apologize for being authentic. And so just approach your life with gushing gusto, like passionately, and just and don't apologize for that. The people that are gonna come around along in your life with you are the people that are meant to be there. And if you change and grow and develop, some people might fall off and that's okay.
Jodi Graham [00:39:54]:
Everybody comes into your life, what is it, reason, season, or a lifetime? As you're growing and developing, people drop off, that's okay. But just be you. Be authentic.
Mahara Wayman [00:40:06]:
Alright. You heard it here, folks. Be authentic and be you is what is what being badass is all about. But, Jody, I wanna thank you again for joining us today and giving us an update because it's been over a year since you first were on the podcast. And can you just, let us know how can our listeners reach you? What's your website?
Jodi Graham [00:40:23]:
My website is empowered collaboration dot ca.
Mahara Wayman [00:40:27]:
Beautiful. So guys, check out the website. Check out the show notes. Everything that you need to know to on how to connect with Jody will be there. And we would love your feedback on our conversation today. And if there's anybody that you know that you think may benefit from from this particular episode, please do share it with them. And as always, I do ask that you rate and leave us some feedback. My name is Mahara.
Mahara Wayman [00:40:48]:
This has been the art of badassery. Thanks to my guest, Jody Graham, today. We'll see you next week. Take care. Thanks for tuning in to another badass episode. Your support means the world to me. So if you enjoyed what you heard today, don't forget to like, share, and rate the episode on your favorite podcast platform. Your feedback keeps the badassery flowing.
Mahara Wayman [00:41:11]:
And, hey, if you're ready to unleash your inner badass and conquer whatever life throws your way, why not book a complimentary badass breakthrough session? Just click the link in the show notes to schedule your session, and let's kick some serious butt together. Until next time, stay fearless, stay fabulous, and of course, stay badass. This is Mahara signing off.
